Sign of a true fan? (or nutter)

noelindublin · Loudmouth

Sign of a true fan? (or nutter)

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

Ha ha what did I say about being a nutter? I've been doing that for years both in ordinary stores and secondhand shops. It's compulsory whenever I visit a music outlet to head first for 'b' and then onto 'g' before I do anything else. Obsessive?

noelindublin · Loudmouth

I don't do it every time but if the albums continue to be stocked, it means they are selling, particularly the first album, Tonic and Surfacing. One thing about online digital copies is that the music cannot go out of print!

The Boomtown Rats have a certain cache of being near the David Bowie section, or is that just in my imagination.

I did see a copy of Vegetarians of Love in a Dublin charity shop recently but would always prefer to buy any Rats/Geldof material in a music shop so that the band/Bob gets whatever is their proper due from making the music. Same with the DVD, on principle could only buy from a musical outlet rather than waiting for a second hand copy.

From what I've read about other atists, royalties from the sale or cd's or DVD's are not that great- a lot going to the record shop or label- hence the trend in recent years for acts to cut out the middleman and get a more direct cut from their work by signing independently of major labels and selling directly from their websites.

suss · In the Long Grass

noelindublin wrote:
Must admit to having the occasional 'habit' over the years, when in record shops of checking Boomtown Rats stock and Bob Geldof stock too!

Who needs to pay for 'therapy' when you can come onto this site for some catharsis?

Glad there are fellow fanatics (nutters) fessing up, although I've only ever looked for Rats and rarely if ever Geldof (just in case some Rats stuff got mislaid).

Anyone else also check the likes of Booker T and Bon Jovi just in case a limited edition of something Rats you never heard of got put back in wrong slot?

Lisa · Mondo Bongo

suss wrote:
Anyone else also check the likes of Booker T and Bon Jovi just in case a limited edition of something Rats you never heard of got put back in wrong slot?

So that's your excuse for all those Boney M records in your collection?

biggrin

Mark L · Loudmouth

Same here! If abroad, I would check there too and for videos too and found the Musikladen vhs in Amsterdam from 1982 (with House on Fire on it) in the mid 1990s and was well happy! Probably on You Tube now, but back in the pre-internet days, you would occasionally strike gold by finding one song on one video compilation and one on another so that by 2000, i think i had 5 Rats videos, each on a separate vhs tape. It was laborious but it all ended in 2005 with the compilation of promos (overdue by 20 years or what?) and the gloriously funny 'Elephant's graveyard' video memoroes came flooding back. What a travesty that this song stalled at 26.

ArrGee · Back To Boomtown

noelindublin wrote:
Must admit to having the occasional 'habit' over the years, when in record shops of checking Boomtown Rats stock and Bob Geldof stock too!
...
The greatest hits never seems to be out of stock or print for the last ten years but before the reissues the Rats were sort of forgotten apart form the hits compilation. Must say that the prices for the Rats cd's always seem reasonable.

I used to do this, but not so much nowadays.

My collection is now more or less complete and nothing of note has been released for a few years. Also there are so few record shops left I don't get the chance.

The hits compilation has done OK in the last ten years. It hasn't racked up mega sales, but constantly ticks along. It's in the top 100 punk albums on Amazon at the moment, which is pretty decent for a ten year old compilation.

ArrGee · Back To Boomtown

Mark L wrote:
...by 2000, i think i had 5 Rats videos, each on a separate vhs tape.

Down the years I bought a whole variety of compilation LPs and tapes for just one or two songs (not Rats one). My grand plan was to get the tracks I wanted copied and ditch the LPs. So when I discovered how to rip CDs that was it for all those Now that's what I call Music albums.

Maybe it was where my dislike of Phil Collins came from cos he seemed to be on all of them!

noelindublin · Loudmouth

Mark L wrote:
Same here! If abroad, I would check there too and for videos too and found the Musikladen vhs in Amsterdam from 1982 (with House on Fire on it) in the mid 1990s and was well happy! Probably on You Tube now, but back in the pre-internet days, you would occasionally strike gold by finding one song on one video compilation and one on another so that by 2000, i think i had 5 Rats videos, each on a separate vhs tape. It was laborious but it all ended in 2005 with the compilation of promos (overdue by 20 years or what?) and the gloriously funny 'Elephant's graveyard' video memoroes came flooding back. What a travesty that this song stalled at 26.

You'd wonder why there wasn't a Rats video compilation released on VHS seeing as the band had been pretty sucessful over the years. Maybe there was some reason for this- I don't know exactly when the first cd compilation was released, possibly early 1990's but there was a significant gap without either a greatest hits or vhs tape compilation throughout the eighties and into the early nineties.

noelindublin · Loudmouth

ArrGee wrote:
noelindublin wrote:
Must admit to having the occasional 'habit' over the years, when in record shops of checking Boomtown Rats stock and Bob Geldof stock too!
...
The greatest hits never seems to be out of stock or print for the last ten years but before the reissues the Rats were sort of forgotten apart form the hits compilation. Must say that the prices for the Rats cd's always seem reasonable.
I used to do this, but not so much nowadays.
My collection is now more or less complete and nothing of note has been released for a few years. Also there are so few record shops left I don't get the chance.
The hits compilation has done OK in the last ten years. It hasn't racked up mega sales, but constantly ticks along. It's in the top 100 punk albums on Amazon at the moment, which is pretty decent for a ten year old compilation.

It's not that I expect new product to appear on the shelves-more to see if it's being restocked and how its selling. Admittedly this is a very unscientific approach but I did this in Amsterdam a month or so back when browsing in a few record shops.

I fully realise that clicks not bricks is the way of the future but while we still have these old fashioned record shops I'll probably continue to do it.

ArrGee · Back To Boomtown

noelindublin wrote:
You'd wonder why there wasn't a Rats video compilation released on VHS seeing as the band had been pretty sucessful over the years. Maybe there was some reason for this- I don't know exactly when the first cd compilation was released, possibly early 1990's but there was a significant gap without either a greatest hits or vhs tape compilation throughout the eighties and into the early nineties.

The only two official VHS releases were Hammersmith 1978 and Dominion 1985.

It is a bit surprising that there were no UK hits compilations until 1994 (Loudmouth) and even then it was somewhat spoiled by being associated with Geldof's lesser solo material (Crazy - mmm).

Even the definitive Best of has a couple of question marks against it (No House on Fire and an abridged Fall Down). The live I Can Make It If You Can was my reason for getting it!

I doubt any more material will ever see an official release.

Mark L · Loudmouth

Yet, in '85 when they played The Odeon in Brum, their tour programme hinted of a compilation vhs and album, I think the proposed title of which was 'Trapped' and which I have in some dark corner of the loft

Not sure why this did not see the light of day and why we had to wait for 1994's Loudmouth, and then just for an album rather than promos compilation

Although Loudmouth went top ten, I can't help feeling a 'best of' around the mid 80s would have scored even better, with the Rats fresher in people's minds.

Wes[Wolverhampton] · House on Fire

I have that tour programme as i do all of them.I also remember that gig in Brum.What a great night it was.A few stars there including the UB40's who were generaly at the Brum gigs.
There were a few greatest hits type lp's released,some very rare but none on general release in the UK and certainly not the one mentioned in the programme.It never saw the light of day.
One of the main problems with the Rats from day 1 was their ability to keep the momentum going.
Having been a fan and collector from day 1 i always found it frustrating to wait so long between albums and tours.I am still here,i know the band very well,but can understand why fans,who are probably[deep down] still fans have drifted.
Mark,i totaly agree with your statement about the mid 80's.I would sugest that more could have been done between perhaps 1981-1985.Easily said in hindsite and i would imagine that the band were looking for quality rather than quality.
The greatest hits are there for ever though!!!!!!

ArrGee · Back To Boomtown

Wes[Wolverhampton] wrote:
One of the main problems with the Rats from day 1 was their ability to keep the momentum going.

In retrospect, they were pretty prolific from September 1977- February 1982. Five albums in just five years is more than most bands these days. Arctic Monkeys have taken over five years to release their first four LPs, and Franz Ferdinand look like taking eight years if they get their fourth album out next year.

After Mondo Bongo, the Rats did effectively disappear from the public eye, with only a couple of appearances on Top of the Pops with House on Fire.

From 1982 onwards, Geldof was doing other things, having a daughter and The Wall comes readily to mind, and the band took a back seat for a couple of years.

I think the momentum was pretty good until Banana Republic, but Mondo Bongo was not well received, and the world had moved on with Adam & The Ants and Spandau Ballet coming to the fore. And make up didn't really suit the Rats.

It is surprising that in the wake of Live Aid, a hits LP wasn't released, but then I suppose there would have been accusations of cashing in. Which of course none of the other acts did....

noelindublin · Loudmouth

When you think about it they had 'product' out in 1977, '78,'79,1980,'81,'82 which is six years in a row. Geldof claimed, I think correctly, that the band suffered from overexposure. Sometimes it's good to take a break (1983/84) and come back refreshed and ready for the fight again.

Agree with ArrGee that if a greatest hits had been released after Live Aid people would have said the whole Live Aid thing was a conspiracy for Geldof to try to sell records.

Maybe the label change from Ensign to Mercury prevented a compilation from being released. There was bad blood between various members of the band after the split so a greatest hits might have needed the backing of all the members as regards who wrote the songs. I'm just speculating here.

In Geldof's words 'You're lucky if time remembers you...'

Mark L · Loudmouth

I was at school in Wolverhampton in 1981 and Elephant's graveyard had just been released. The playground barometer on these things at age 14 was usually a good measure of who was 'in' and who was 'out' and I distinctly remember the Rats were still well thought of (although the nature of Banana Republic was quite a surprise to most of us) and a few of us had picked up (as 14 yr old boys would!) on the video for EG when shown on Tiswas the previous Saturday and the bit where there is a split second of animal 'frolics' shall we say depicted as the natural follow-on to Simon and Pete chasing the beach cuties! It was still quite trendy to be into Bob and the boys. Then suddenly, despite the catchy chorus of the song and amusing video, the song ground to a halt at 26 and no third single followed and as Wes suggests, it seemed an age until Million Years and the gap had started filling with New Romantics et al. The barometer quickly changed to 'rats on the slide' and it was not cool from 1982 onwards to admit to liking them. Unfair, as V Deep contains the brilliant He Watches It All and House on Fire which was good. However, I could not persuade people to re-appraise them on the strength of the disappointing Charmed Lives and by 1984's Drag Me Down, the tide could not be turned despite the song's obvious hooks and relatively extensive airplay. Everyone saw them on Cheggers Plays Pop and Razzamattaz, TVAM and so on (not dissimilar to the extensive tv studio touring that accompanied Silly Pretty Thing) and I'm pretty sure Mike Read had it as Record of the Week, but it could only manage 50. It was a travesty as it is a good song (look how the Live Aid audience can be heard picking it up and singing it back when for most it must have been a 'first listen') but it only goes to show possibly what's cool is cool and what is not is not.

noelindublin · Loudmouth

As singles I think both Tonight and A Hold Of Me are masterful. Unfortunately these songs will be unfamiliar to most music fans having gotten almost no airplay. In The Long Grass was a true vindication of the band and at least they went out on a good note.

Certain of us stuck with the band because we never lost faith, despite the occasional glitch. Most bands don't sell their entire catalogue at a constant level- there will always be peaks and troughs due to the vagaries of the music scene and popular tastes. Lots of great music gets 'lost' while some terrible dross gets to the top. Such is the way of the world. It is a bit sad when some really great bands or albums get overlooked or are deemed no longer to be trendy.

ArrGee · Back To Boomtown

Mark L wrote:
The barometer quickly changed to 'rats on the slide' and it was not cool from 1982 onwards to admit to liking them. Unfair, as V Deep contains the brilliant He Watches It All and House on Fire which was good.

I remember buying V Deep at a record shop near Archway on Holloway Road, London and the owner saying he had listened to it and was surprised at how good it was given he didn't rate the Rats too much.

The UK single choices off the album weren't the best. Million Years and Charmed Lives were weak compared to what had gone before. Up All Night was a far stronger single. It had got a lot of radio play in North America, and there was a dance mix that went down well in the clubs as well.

The Rats needed to make a big mark when they came back in early 1982, but it never happened. The Stranglers released Golden Brown about the same time after half a dozen of so singles failing to trouble the top 30, and that gave them some further impetus.

By the time they had some good single material like Dave and A Hold of Me, people had stopped buying the records.

ArrGee · Back To Boomtown

noelindublin wrote:
In The Long Grass was a true vindication of the band and at least they went out on a good note.

Definitely.

I think the shame is that it took so long to get released there was no audience for it.

Mark L · Loudmouth

Yes, I think Up All Night would have fared much better than Million Years, followed by HWIA and then House on Fire. I think Dave is breathtaking, but I have never got A Hold of Me. The lyrics are good but it just can't take to it. i suppose we all have our 'skip' songs and 'Can't stop' and 'Beat of the night' I nearly always skip too. I should give them a fairer hearing perhaps. At the moment, I have TFAOS on in the car and I keep getting blown away with how brilliant Real Different is. I must have looked a right sight coming home tonight, singing this in rush hour traffic in Congleton, the car driver next lane gave me a proper 'Wicker chair away from rehabilitation' look!

ArrGee · Back To Boomtown

Mark L wrote:
Yes, I think Up All Night would have fared much better than Million Years, followed by HWIA and then House on Fire.

He Watches It All is my favourite track on V Deep, but I'm not sure if it would have been a good single. Fall Down is also a superb track, but I'm not sure if that would have been a good single either.

Up All Night was a missed opportunity. It was the most club orientated track the Rats made, and given its impact ouside the UK prior to V Deep, it seems strange that it was not released.

Top 200 - 1981 Germany

http://www.ukmix.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=480819

54 - Club Play Singles US - the highest position in any US chart

http://www.ukmix.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=898369

Mark L · Loudmouth

Thanks for those links. I agree - my favourite track too on V Deep. As for good choice or not as a single, i suppose it's a subjective one but when someone obviously thought Charmed Lives was suitable single material, I am happy to at least put HWIA forward as a contender!

Fall Down - yes great track agreed - but indeed it would have either crashed and burned or shone brightly and my money would have been more on the former. Elephant's Graveyard was the obvious single with a 'commercial' feel to it if that's the right phrase, but like Pulp's brilliant Help the Aged, and as BG once remarked I think, pop music and pensioners are not always good bed fellows!

noelindublin · Loudmouth

Mark L wrote:
Yes, I think Up All Night would have fared much better than Million Years, followed by HWIA and then House on Fire. I think Dave is breathtaking, but I have never got A Hold of Me. The lyrics are good but it just can't take to it. i suppose we all have our 'skip' songs and 'Can't stop' and 'Beat of the night' I nearly always skip too. I should give them a fairer hearing perhaps. At the moment, I have TFAOS on in the car and I keep getting blown away with how brilliant Real Different is. I must have looked a right sight coming home tonight, singing this in rush hour traffic in Congleton, the car driver next lane gave me a proper 'Wicker chair away from rehabilitation' look!

Real Different is my all time favourite Rats track so glad somebody thinks its brilliant. I've loved this song for years and its theme of stagnation and boredom echoes Nothing Happened Today- great lyrics: 'A new day but it's no different/Stop and turn away for more of the same....'

That 'Wicker chair away from rehabilitation' line always had me stumped, as until the Surfacing reissue the lyrics had never been published, so a lot of the great lines in the song were unclear. I consider it the archetypal Rats track, with a lot of their trademark sounds all in the one tune- brilliant backing vocals, theme of boredom, the plaintive oh oh oh oh bit, great wall of sound guitar and a great tune. What more can I say?

I always though A Hold Of Me is a Rats classic and almost instantly easy 'to get'. Should give it a few plays as the tune to me is pretty distinct and hopefully worth reinvestigation. In truth there are very few Rats songs that I actively dislike.

Mark L · Loudmouth

Real Different is amazing, lyrically and musically. I find shades of it in Elephant's Graveyard and Hard Times (turn away etc) and Late last night and Go man go, but to me it beats them all, for all the reasons you so effectively state. My favourite Rats song too, so odd it was considered 'b' side material only. The lyrics evaded me for years too in parts, but that didn't stop continuously playing it trying to get them, sometimes as 33 speed to see if that helped!

In regard to AHOM, it's interesting that we so agree on RD and yet the former is interpreted differently. I suppose it's down to individual sensibilities and shows the concept of subjectivity at play.

Would be interested to know how Having my picture taken grabs you Noel.....

noelindublin · Loudmouth

Mark L wrote:
Real Different is amazing, lyrically and musically. I find shades of it in Elephant's Graveyard and Hard Times (turn away etc) and Late last night and Go man go, but to me it beats them all, for all the reasons you so effectively state. My favourite Rats song too, so odd it was considered 'b' side material only. The lyrics evaded me for years too in parts, but that didn't stop continuously playing it trying to get them, sometimes as 33 speed to see if that helped!
In regard to AHOM, it's interesting that we so agree on RD and yet the former is interpreted differently. I suppose it's down to individual sensibilities and shows the concept of subjectivity at play.
Would be interested to know how Having my picture taken grabs you Noel.....

Having My Picture Taken is a top tune and as usual with the Rats great lyrics too. There was very good quality footage of this song from a gig in the Nederlands in 1979/80 in which Geldof invited fans on to the stage and the stage was pretty much crowded with Dutch teenagers singing along.

Don't know what happen to that upload as I've tried to find it and it seems to have disappeared off the 'net. Presumably that whole gig was filmed and the quality was very good so it must be in some tv archive in Amsterdam or somewhere. It was from a concert rather than a television appearance.

Mark L · Loudmouth

Yeah, it's one of their best in my view too. The middle guitar break is awesome. I get 'watch the birdie' just about, but what does Bob say immediately before - always evades me?

Nice Polaroid 1000 sound at the end too!

suss · In the Long Grass

Mark L wrote:
Yeah, it's one of their best in my view too. The middle guitar break is awesome. I get 'watch the birdie' just about, but what does Bob say immediately before - always evades me?
Nice Polaroid 1000 sound at the end too!

I've always thought it was 'hold it fellas', as in hold a pose.